Dr Z

Just a set up a forum area, perhaps just for Donating Members?...as a free-for-all, there-are-no-rules flame area for verbal sparring with the same spirit as Ultimate Fighting Championship. Not only would it be entertaining for spectators and participants, it would help keep it off the other forum areas, gives people a place to "unwind" and let off steam, and given the area is all about verbal sparring, it is more likely something we could all laugh at and not take too seriously. Best benefit is you only go there if you want to, so if you want to stay out of there, it is your choice.

For clarity, what I quoted can be tracked in this thread how fast do you expect? ..and further clarification can be seen in this thread FPV, TYPHOON TIMES ..illustrating they were estimates of F6 performance times based on comparisons with APS kit times using an ET calculator. The contributions in these two threads by others also adds context to the times originally quoted in this thread, though my personal conclusion remains the same: In short, I am so glad I did not shell out uber-dollars on exchanging my XR6T for the 6 speed F6. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Spot on Jeff. Most of the guys on this forum haven't been around long enough to understand that it's torque delivery that is one of the main factors, not maximum power or torque, ceterus parabus. The torque generated by the F6 at much lower revs will make a huge difference. For others who quote Dr Z torque figures they are wasting our time. Brian <{POST_SNAPBACK}> For further clarification, Dr Z's APS Power/Torque figures are those supplied to him by APS, while the performance times are those sourced from the collated spreadsheet by Turbodewd. Thanks APS and Turbodewd! Unless there is some serious power downgrading happening at higher RPMs with boost or ECU management, if you do the Power/Torque maths, I agree with Geeseman that the originially quoted times in this thread: ..do not appear to be consistent with the APS kit performance times based on the APS claimed Power/Torque figures. Brian mentions "Ceteris Paribus" (Latin for "all other things being equal"), and if the F6 had the same auto transmission as the XR6T, with those claimed Power/Torque figures, in order to be consistent with what we know from the APS kit outputs, I would expect the F6 to have approximately 5.3s/13.5s. However, all other things are NOT equal. The 6 speed manual introduces a new variable and is expected to slow those times considerably (perhaps even up to 0.3s-0.5s) together with a small increase in weight of the F6 over the XR6T. As for Brian's comment: ..I would direct him and others to this thread how fast do you expect? ..to see that back in August 30, 2004 I made the same important point about Torque he is making now while inferring that I do not know about any of this because somehow power/torque delivery knowledge is highly positively correlated to the length of time spent on this forum. In addition, this thread clearly evidences my estimates of F6 performance times based on comparisons with APS kit times. In short, I am so glad I did not shell out uber-dollars on exchanging my XR6T for the 6 speed F6. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

The November 2002 issue of Wheels has: VY Expensive Daewoo Late model camira SS 0-100km/hr: 6.2s 0-400m: 14.5s BA Ford Falcon XR6T 0-100km/hr: 6.0s 0-400m: 14.3s The September 2004 issue of Motor has:* VY Expensive Daewoo Late model camira SS 0-100km/hr: 5.82s 0-400m: 13.99s * Note: This is widely considered by many to be ATYPICAL of standard acceleration launches by this car and that it was a one-off FREAK launch, that no one can come close to replicating in a stock vehicle. The fact that no one has come close to these times in a stock SS since, suggests the timing equipment may not have been correctly set up and/or, as has often been suggested, Expensive Daewoo handed Motor magazine one if its "special" cars. Anecdotally, with my stock XR6T, not one SS off the lights or in the 80-120km/hr range has come anywhere close in a friendly spirited straight-line performance contest. The October 2003 issue of Motor has: BA Ford Falcon XR6T 0-100km/hr: 5.91s 0-400m: 14.14s In short, "real world" times suggest the BA XR6T has marginally quicker acceleration than the VY SS V8 in "stock" (unmodified) comparisons. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

The law is applied equally to all citizens, just some more equally than others.

Since I went APS Phase II with Spiro at Autotech, not a single overboost.

Solid review. :o Correct me if I am wrong but I thought that: 1. The F6 intercooler was 50% bigger than the XR6T, not twice the size. 2. The Brembo brakes have 4 pistons front and 2 in the back, not 2 in front and 1 in back. If anyone could confirm, that would be great...too busy to look it up. :roll:

Sorry, I don't see the problem. Just buy the manual for yourself and find yourself a woman who CAN drive it. That is, if you want to share your car ... :bomb: <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Turbo, good advice, though I think the real problem is it is not just one woman, but women..

Advanced driver training and/or Stage 3 training for your CAMS licence. I hope I find that in my Santa stocking this Christmas. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Quoting November 2004 Motor magazine on page 64, according to HSV: Manual: 0-100km/hr: 5.2s 0-400m : 13.5s Top speed: 270km/hr (gearing-limited) Auto: 0-100km/hr: 5.1s 0-400m : 13.3s Top speed: 274km/hr (drag-limited)

I strongly agree with jteale on this one. In general, if a dealer passes on any puzzling information, try another dealer.

..worst part about all this is the crackdown on oral sex..

Yeah, I thought I was on a good thing...I put $12.5m on RED and $12.5m on BLACK thinking I couldn't lose, but the darned ball rolled on the GREEN number 0!

While it is difficult to advise anyone, because we are all unique individuals with unique thoughts, feelings, aspirations, enjoyment parameters etc, having recently faced this decision, this is what I did: Before I made my decision, I checked out the F6 Typhoon, and yes it would be a great car to drive, but rather than shell out $30,000+ for a trade-in changeover on a 4 month old (May 2004) XR6T, I'd rather pay much less for an even quicker car. In short, * my head said APS Phase II - costs much less than an F6 Typhoon * my heart said APS Phase II - is quicker than an F6 Typhoon * my soul said APS Phase II - the Phase II power delivery will be good for my soul With my mind, heart and soul all agreeing on the same decision outcome, how could I resist? Best wishes with your choice and I hope you glean some good insights shared by others here. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

On another note, APS are doing a Twin Turbo version of the Boss just like they did with the record-setting LS1. Check out the "other" forum in the FPV section or PM me for details. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Thanks for the dynos folks.. ..however I too remain skeptical of large power increases of stock T's with no interceptors or tuning just out of an exhaust upgrade. As I mentioned in the original thread about this, a dyno of it would help us see a SAMPLE of what was happening. Even if this was achievable, I still do not see how the ECU would allow it without any erratic boosting or limping, because that goes against everything we know about the XR6T ECU. In summary, a little while back we asked for dynos of this, and after this dyno day we are still asking for dynos of this...so we all look forward to being enlightened as to how a bolt-on with NO additional tuning can "beat the ECU". Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

There is a good layperson oriented article titled "Power versus Torque: Part 1" with a sub-title of "So which do you need more of to go fast - power or torque?" and you can find that HERE. Part 2 of this series titled "Power versus Torque: Part 2" with a sub-title of "Torque is for acceleration and power is for top speed... or is it?" can be found HERE. For those who do not have the time or inclination to read these 2 articles, here are some conclusions, as directly quoted in yellow: * So, it is clear that you can compensate for a lack of torque if you have power. * But you cannot compensate for a lack of power by gearing. * So power is the critical determining factor for maximum acceleration, and torque is necessary for driveability. Finally, if that isn't enough talk about torque, there are two articles (Part 1 and Part 2) titled "Constant Torque Performance" with a sub-title of "Constant torque - the driveline-friendly approach to performance..." where you can find Part 1 HERE and Part 2 HERE. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Not being a doubting Thomas, but maximum power figures only tell PART of the story of a street driveable vehicle. Show us the dynos, and I would particularly want to see it mapped against boost to see if there is any erratic boosting. In short, dynos tell the story behind the numbers that quoting maximum power figures does not, so "show us the dynos". Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Hmm, perhaps the reason Ken has forgotten to come here is he may be suffering from amnesia and an identity crisis... Ken in Lord of the Rings

Spot on Lawsy, the torque would be the weakness of an SV6 Alloytec Turbo compared to an XR6T derivative with the I6, thereby giving it less acceleration, all other things assumed equal. However, they are not equal, as current VZ Holden/HSV vehicles do not carry the mass of the BA, so it may be closer than we think. Also, the primary sources of blown SV6 "mules" running around Victoria does not come from Holden/HSV engineers. If you think about that carefully, it has massively interesting implications. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Not sure if this helps with the mystery, but I received this postcard just the other day, and it seems to raise more questions than delivers answers.. ..out on a cruise in Blueprint with a blonde? Mid-life crisis? What do you guys think?

Anyone here remember that story about that guy who did work experience at Ford/FPV who "borrowed" one of the flagship cars to take it out on a FordXR6Turbo.com cruise and then let all the cruise participants take turns for a spin? Remember that? Remember how Ford/FPV Executives were SO impressed with his initiative of "bringing the product to the people" that they instantly promoted him to Director of Marketing? Anyway, what do you think the chances are that doing this again could result in a similar career boost?

I think its more dependant on the varying quality of factory components. We have seen some people with stock Ts have problems with transmissions, manual and auto. Modded Ts have also had issues with only 250rwkw, while some are running down the drags with 350rwkw. Its the luck of the draw. Given good enough factory components, the number of successful running modded Ts suggests that you can mod the car up to reasonable power levels and not expect too much trouble. Nothing is guaranteed though and that's life. Geeseman, I agree. I had my 3rd automatic transmission installed on a stock T in less than 5000 km, and I did not drive my car all that hard. The first transmission to blow was FPV's fault for not plugging the PCM in properly which seriously played havoc with the entire driveline. The second transmission made noises that were way too loud. In short, it is a great point you make that not even all factory components have the same level of manufactured quality. In essence, original manufacturing quality and type of driving style are two highly significant factors in the long term reliability of anyone's driveline, stock or modified, though modified will increase the probabilities of component failure. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

Interesting points bcl, though one wonders if ANY OEM or after-market tuner can offer ANY guarantees that driveline components may not break down. At the Sydney APS day earlier in 2004, I distinctly recall David Inall mentioning multiple times that long term reliability and longevity of driveline components is largely dependent on the type of driving style by the driver. Also, as you may recall this caveat came following advice about David's confidence in the T5. For example, even Ford gets testy about warranty if they suspect "hard" driving to be the cause of problems. So does anyone know of ANY OEM or after-market tuner that offers 100% guarantees of driveline components without such caveats? If so, please enlighten us. Safe and happy driving...Dr Z.

More of a case that I could not trust myself to hold back on giving it a squirt, which may be fine for strip or track but street..