Street Tuner

I am not sure what maps CAPA have sent you as they are not 'open' today. However, finally down the end of the path it will end up my responsibility to resolve this issue, hence my offer is to email FIST two excellent, known, working 8 and 10psi maps whenever you say the word.

I did actually answer in this thread already...but maybe it was in the other double posted one. Regardless. What you have there is an early version of the generic map which used pure wastegate valve duty cycle control to determine boost, meaning that the output of the boost controller will never actually be constant over the length of the power run. Later versions (and that must be heading to three months + old now) will maintain the desired boost across the entire operating range and therefore make more top end power. Probably best to send your box back to CAPA for a tune update if you arent going down the custom tune path.

When did you buy your flasher? Those are very old programs (six months +) that have either been accidentally fitted to your box, or indeed your box is that old. Good news is all you need to to is send it back to CAPA for reloading of the latest programs.

I do believe Tony from CAPA spoke to you today about this.

Yes you should be getting cranky. However I will struggle to explain any concept when the basic fundamentals of binary logic arent fully understood. My earlier post outlined exactly how the pcm write takes place. If you choose not to accept that, then we have nothing further to discuss here.

The difficulties you explain are a function of your chosen tuner rather than the pcm writing process. In fact regardless of whether you reflashed the pcm three times in half an hour it would seem that the boost control method used by your tuner is so far out of whack to have almost no chance.

No. What was the exact difference though? How much did engine power output change, boost level etc. Post the dyno sheets. Yes Yes. Plenty of factory tunes hit overboost. No. Put the car back to stock, and put your flasher on Ebay. that's my best advice for you.

Just noticed this thread. During the upload process a CRC32 (Cyclic Redundancy Check) is carried out to ensure that the final checksum of the PCM matches the checksum of the program in the flasher. If there is only one bit of one byte that is not written correctly the engine will not crank or fire and the Flash Tuner will set a code. At which point you need to reload the stock program and start again. It is in effect a digital system that simply 'counts' not some sort of human based interface that is prone to making mistakes. However the program itself that you load into the PCM is in fact adaptive and can make changes to the way the engine runs due to environmental conditions, which can make the car feel 'better' or 'worse' under varying circumstances, which is where your tuner comes into it. The good ones make the cars performance linear across the range of different environmentals, hence the car will always feel good. The actual PCM write process being used with the CAPA Flash Tuner is identical to the one that Ford use. It has to be, or the whole process simply wouldnt work. These are Falcons, not Christine.

I suppose the concept is to understand that there can be batch differences in fuel and not to tune to the ragged edge unless using a professional race fuel such as ELF LMS or VP 109 where the consituents are guaranteed via quantity, hence octane. Pump fuel is generally never repeatable enough, hence knock sensors are used on most modern high performance engines. Make sense now?

If you have your factory map loaded the only way they can detect 'Edit' is if you tell them, or leave the box in the console or the glovebox for them to see. Simple as that.

Excellent technical post as always Dingah.....glad to see another happy customer

It is quite possible to have Shoot_81 and no Shoot_6F mode. Depends on your version of software. Indeed the Willall Racing dyno that I do most of my 'T's on has only Shoot_81 and no 6F. Bummer that. Shoot_81 has the very same ramp rate and very very similar inertia to the early Shoot_6F setting, so the results are near identical to those you could achieve with on any current Dyno Dynamics dyno. All the settings are there printed on the bottom of the screen. I think the point though was regardless of any power output (it has 968 injectors by the way) that this little 'Vixen' ute runs hard without rattling its head off, and will do even on 95RON fuel and stock spark plugs. Great achievement Simon! Keep em coming mate!

You wont do it with the SCT tools you know... All of what you are talking about is controlled by the BCM (Body Control) as Goldie pointed out and has nothing to to with the PCM (Powetrain Control). Two totally separate pieces of hardware unfortunately

That is correct Danno. Protects the tuners from having their work plagiarised. Our scanner though can very quickly show commanded boost, fuel, and timing settings, along with stuff like whether the knock sensors are working etc. As for the knock sensor count? The software will let you go to a maximum of '2' in that field, and if you change it from stock to this number, makes the obviously stupid assumption that you might be a professional engine tuner that knows what he/she is doing, and therefore tries to enable the system. Its a simple command....and one we cant 'protect' against.

I am not totally sure of that answer F6...I will have to dig through the code to work that one out. My understanding though is that the PCM groups the knock control system as a whole, and will shutdown the lot if it sees a partial fault. The system may not log an error code that can be scanned either, as since the provision for a second sensor was never there in the first place, the error report hasnt been written for it.

Nick, all BA Falcon 240 and 270 Gull engines (XR6T and Typhoon) have always only ever had one knock sensor. that's a pretty fundamental piece of understanding. Just like they have six cylinders, not seven. Activating a second non-existant knock sensor as done in your example will instigate a PCM fault condition (it believes the second knock sensor must be faulty as it receives no program response) which will immediately reduce engine timing by a preset protection amount, and hence decrease performance to save any potential engine damage from a 'dead' second knock sensor. Now be very careful when you fix these customers programs, as you have no doubt tuned around the fault condition (it takes out around 6 degrees of total ignition timing), which will no longer exist when you correctly tell the system it only has one knock sensor again. Hence they will have around 6 degrees more ignition timing, which will put them very close to (over) the knock threshold of the engine. The reality is that you will need to retune these cars to ensure correct operation. Your best bet would be to book them in for a retune next time you are in Perth, and run them on the factory map until then, as I am not totally sure of any other side affects this may have on the PCM hence engine operation.

that's the good thing about a Power FC Brian. The bad thing is that while it will flash the light like crazy it doesnt take any timing out to correct the situation. When tuned correctly the XR6T doesnt bother the driver with a light, it does what its supposed to do and remove timing to stop detonation....and it works a treat. The last thing you need is a driver involved in the process its between the PCM and the engine

Nick, you might want to have a closer look at a BA F6 Typhoon/Tornado. They only have one knock sensor, so the software was quite correct.......

Nick, I upgraded your software to User Level 4 (highest level) on the Melbourne training day. To achieve a user level upgrade a special 50 character key is required for registration of the software - which Jerry supplied on the day and only SCT can generate. Which is why I know for a fact that since you left that training day your Advantage executable files have not been upgraded...as you would need another key, and we monitor who, why, and when so we can keep track of the software. There has been no key generation for XTC since then, and indeed their shouldnt be, as you had the highest possible user level, and the latest version of executeable software. However, we also update the database - which contains all of the program information and tables - on a regular basis, with each and every dealer being notified via email when a new database has been generated, and then tested ready for distribution. This database can then be downloaded from the CAPA FTP site for immediate use. I checked that you are indeed on the email list, and sure enough Tim from CAPA emails the xtcaust@smartchat email address with instructions on how to update your system each and every time a database is released. Possibly this email address is no longer valid, in which case you need to update it with CAPA, as they cannot guess this kind of thing. Maybe after seeing that Barry had a later version of the database you might have rung them and asked why you didnt have it? There has been no logged support call at CAPA from XTC on this subject. While it would be nice to list every single feature of the stock PCM in software, we dont, for a number of reasons. The biggest is 'if it aint broke dont fix it'. I note that you currently claim to be adjusting knock sensor gains since they have become available, which is an area fraught with peril unless you have the sophisticated lab style equipment to perform the calibration. This feature was added for Nizpro since they do in fact have the in-cylinder pressure transducers required for calibration, and have 500rwkw+ engines with internal harmonics far removed from standard that demand this unique feature. As such we have made this feature available for everyone on User Level 4 to access. How did Nizpro get us to do this? They simply logged a request with a detailed engineering explanation of what they required, and why, at which stage the database was modified to suit. If you have a specific software requirement then I ask that you follow the same procedure. Outline exactly what it is you require, and why you require it (we need to understand what you are trying to do so the correct variables can be added), and it will be done in a timely fashion. Still existing functionality has allowed some incredible achievements. There are plenty around that consider the current revision database to have everything required for even the most modified of engines. The fact that street driven 9 second XR6Ts have been made a reality by CAPA Flash Tuning points towards the effectiveness of its overall functionality. Like any other tool kit Nick, the real skill is in using the right sized spanner on the right sized bolt.

The Advantage software itself is simply a menu driven table editor. that's the very simple part. Its the factory BlackOak PCM that is extremely complicated and uses a lot of engineering based terminology, because it was designed to be tuned by enigneers. that's the Catch 22. If the tuners want full functionality, then they have to think like a factory engineer to get the very best from the system. If they want a simplified version then they wont have access to the full parameter list. All of which is why we have four configureable 'User Levels' in the software (1 for simple, 4 for advanced) which allow different levels of access to some of the more sophisticated functions. While a professional calibrator might want the lot, there are some guys that specifically request a simplified version so that they can get tuning quickly. For anyone that thinks the BA system is tricky now though, wait till the introduction of "Torque based throttle" control into Australia to replace the simple "Driver Demand" system that we have on our electronic throttles now. I spent two days just getting my head around this....and still have plenty of questions

Spot on Phoon. All I have ever done in this thread is post facts. When I tune I dont use emotion or heresay....I use skill and experience

Not into singling anything or anyone out here, just giving a generic example for the process of answering the question

Look at it this way Ross, if your ears have heard the engine pinging, then the knock sensors heard it long, long before you did. In fact the most damaging type of detonation is the light and inaudible version, because the driver doesn't understand to lift off...they cant hear anything wrong. Thankfully the knock sensor knows all about this 'Delta 1' knock (as some describe it) and takes according remedial action. If you hear detonation in an XR6T engine it can mean a few different things. The first of course is that the knock sensor itself has simply been switched off. This we have convered, and there is really no sane reason for it in a road car. However the engine can still ping if physical conditions are met that the activity of the knock sensor cannot correct. Take my 'hypothetical' example...... A dead standard 'T' running 19psi of boost at 3500rpm, with 22 degrees ignition timing in the map, and a commanded AFR of 14.X:1. Even with the stock 12 degrees of timing the knock sensor can (and will) pull out of the map, the boost is so far 'off the scale', and the mixture so lean, that almost no amount of timing retard will protect the engine from destructive high speed detonation If you can hear detonation at all, then its a fair bet you have bags of low level inaudible pinging as well. My best advice is to seek a professional tuner - and I dont know or care who tuned your car - who understands the very basic fundamentals and physics involved in tuning a modern four stroke engine. Its not magic and guesswork...its science

I am disappointed when peoples engines end up spread all over the ground. All tuners - no matter who or with what - have a duty of care to the general public. Even though you dont like what I have to say here, its the people such as yourself, who are end users, whose interests I am putting first and foremost. Hopefully you might be able to glean something constructive from this.

No more of these 300rwkw stock injector promises. It does no one any good to carry on like this, and is misleading to the general public. I thought we were all over this rubbish a year ago. Obviously not, and quite frankly I find it very disappointing by all involved.