Zf Six Speed

[Turbo6man]

With the upcoming introduction of the 6-speed auto there will be a major shift in diff gear sets.

I've been told Ford are going away from Dana/Spicer and will be using another diff supplier who is working with a brief to replicate the old 9" FMX diffs we all knew so well in the 70s, but of course adapted to the control blade rear end.

Now the ratios of the ZF auto are pretty well a known thing - and the nature of the ratios will not work at all with the ratios we see currently and will require a diff ratio in the order of 3:1 or higher. Maybe as high as 2.75 or even 2.5:1.

This brings a very pertinent question to my mind. Given the cost effectiveness, or otherwise, of having two very different diff ratios (in fact completely different difffs) available to suit both the new ZF auto and the present range of T5s and T56s, I reckon Ford will be looking towards a new manual gearbox that will slot behind the new diffs. There are currently three ZF manuals that could be used. The S6-37 and S6-37 Close Ratio, both used by makers such as BMW, or the very heavy duty S6-53 as used in the Land Rovers etc. If they went for the S6-53, they would probably have to have a different gear set as the Landy obviously needs much lower gearing than the Ford would. First in the Landy is 5:1.

I would expect these manuals to be brought online with the next new Falcon model due in 2006/2007.

Maybe it's just wishful thinking?

[ZAP]

You can bet that whatever choice Ford make, it will be the CHEAPEST and easiest solution .

I bet they will also ask the diff/gearbox makers for the 2nd's quality as we all expect the normal backlash we have grown to love in all Oz Ford cars

[Venom XR6]

If they wanted a new manufacturer of diffs they would get them to make a few versions to suit all models in the range, with a couple of different sets of diff ratios to suit. They currently use 2 different types of diff, the M78 and the M86, which I think refers to the size in inches eg. 7.8 and 8.6 inch.

After just installing the T56 would would they bother switching to a more expensive manual that does the same job cheaper. It might not be as good as the ZF but they are strong and do the job.

[Turbo6man]

If they wanted a new manufacturer of diffs they would get them to make a few versions to suit all models in the range, with a couple of different sets of diff ratios to suit. They currently use 2 different types of diff, the M78 and the M86, which I think refers to the size in inches eg. 7.8 and 8.6 inch.

After just installing the T56 would would they bother switching to a more expensive manual that does the same job cheaper. It might not be as good as the ZF but they are strong and do the job.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That raises a couple of points.

The T56 is in fact a poor man's version of the old ZF S6-40 - virtually a copy. So maybe Ford will get Tremec to build a cheaper version of the S6-53.

On the other hand Ford and ZF have done business together in the past. I'm not sure if in fact Ford don't own some shares in ZF. I know Ford did a deal with them a while back - sold a manufacturing plant in Europe to ZF for manufacturing transmissions.

It's even possibly that Ford will manufacture the new autos themselves (and maybe manuals also) under licence, as ZF may not have the capacity to supply the number of units that Ford would need.

[CHIPS]

Maybe it's just wishful thinking?

I think you've got that bit right Jeff!

[FPV329]

Maybe it's just wishful thinking?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you've got that bit right Jeff!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[WBT56]

...The T56 is in fact a poor man's version of the old ZF S6-40 - virtually a copy. So maybe Ford will get Tremec to build a cheaper version of the S6-53....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nothing wrong at all with a properly set up Tremec. Remember, the Tremec you hate so much in particular owes 90% of its problems to the fact that it is a Getrag in design, and this carried over all of their inherant problems. The one true problem in the TR3650 that is attributed to Tremec did not appear until BA anyway. Ben.

[Turbo6man]

...The T56 is in fact a poor man's version of the old ZF S6-40 - virtually a copy. So maybe Ford will get Tremec to build a cheaper version of the S6-53....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nothing wrong at all with a properly set up Tremec. Remember, the Tremec you hate so much in particular owes 90% of its problems to the fact that it is a Getrag in design, and this carried over all of their inherant problems. Ben.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's right Ben ... and the reason I've now also turned away from the idea of a Getrag for my T3. I've heard so many complaints about them from the SkylineAU guys. I'm now seriously pondering a ZF BUT the big problem is the short gearing and the fact I'm going to have trouble getting a tall enough diff gear into my DANA to suit. Do you have any thoughts/suggestions on this?

[WBT56]

..That's right Ben ... and the reason I've now also turned away from the idea of a Getrag for my T3. I've heard so many complaints about them from the SkylineAU guys. I'm now seriously pondering a ZF BUT the big problem is the short gearing and the fact I'm going to have trouble getting a tall enough diff gear into my DANA to suit. Do you have any thoughts/suggestions on this?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You know our solution, but anyway.......as far as a taller diff gearing goes, you can use 3.08, 2.92 or 2.77 if you really want to. There was a 2.54 available, but I do not know the whereabouts of any gearsets in this ratio. Ben.

[Turbo6man]

Thanks Ben, yeah I do know your solution for the gearbox. And I know the people you've helped are generally happy. Unfortunately I'm not convinced the T56 is any better with backlash and roll-over than my TR3650. The ones I've driven are 50/50 at best, and some people with GTs are complaining bitterly, so I just don't know where to turn. An $8,000 gamble is way outa my league.

I am very interested though that you say those ratios are available for mine - I was told that 3.45 was the tallest, and that the only optional ratio other than that was the 3.73 which isn't suitable for me at all. Now the 3.08 if available might suit OK.