I've been reading over some old threads - boy people were down on the F6 when they first came out!

At the time (which was BA Mk1 I think, before the clutch fix) the F6 dyno's were apparently showing:

- 200ish RWKw which was apparently not much more than many XR6Ts (however this apparently was on a new engine which hadn't been worked in properly yet).

- A torque curve which dropped off pretty rapidly above 4000RPM

Now, with BF out, there don't seem to be people bashing the performance any more.

Why? Has something changed? Does the BF have more power than the BA Mk1? (even though 'officially' they are the same?). Does the torque curve hold up better at high revs on the BF? What about the BA-Mk2?

Or is it just that people had unrealistic expectations back then and the BA F6's were fine?

I ask because I am considering buying an ex-demo BA-Mk2 manual which I can get for a pretty good price.

What I really want to know is whether the BA-Mk2 manuals are known to have less power than the BF manuals?

Note: I realise that modding is an easy way to get a lot of power out of any F6 BUT I really just want to run a stock car... a fast stock car of course! Hence my interest in stock F6s.

Well, the BF manual has dyno'd extremely well. My own pulled 253.5rwkw completely stock on the Nizpro dyno (after 11,000kms), and another that was only 100km old pulled 248rwkw on the same dyno. Another bloke I know of, pulled 253rwkw same as me not sure what type of dyno.

Happy dynos or not, the BF's comply with the new ECE measurement which required the peak power to be held for one full minute. As such, it's likely that Ford/FPV had to make the power more erm... consistent for the BF to be able to call it a 270kw machine.

There's a good post around here on the same issue, I'll see if I can find it.

I've been reading over some old threads - boy people were down on the F6 when they first came out! 

At the time (which was BA Mk1 I think, before the clutch fix) the F6 dyno's were apparently showing:

- 200ish RWKw which was apparently not much more than many XR6Ts (however this apparently was on a new engine which hadn't been worked in properly yet).

- A torque curve which dropped off pretty rapidly above 4000RPM

Now, with BF out, there don't seem to be people bashing the performance any more.

Why? Has something changed? Does the BF have more power than the BA Mk1? (even though 'officially' they are the same?). Does the torque curve hold up better at high revs on the BF? What about the BA-Mk2?

Or is it just that people had unrealistic expectations back then and the BA F6's were fine?

I ask because I am considering buying an ex-demo BA-Mk2 manual which I can get for a pretty good price.

What I really want to know is whether the BA-Mk2 manuals are known to have less power than the BF manuals?

Note: I realise that modding is an easy way to get a lot of power out of any F6 BUT I really just want to run a stock car... a fast stock car of course!    Hence my interest in stock F6s.

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My guess is that the BF has more grunt than the BA. Ford seems to be under quoting the power of the BF. Stock they're producing around 230rwkw (depending on the dyno) which would indicate around 300fwkw. I don't think the BAs were producing these numbers stock. BF received a bunch of mods to increase power (including different cams I believe) to compensate for a loss of power resulting from changes to meet the euro 3 emission requirements.

Here's the post I was on about re: ECE measurement.

"There is another factor that makes direct comparison difficult. Until the start of 2006, manufacturers could measure their power and torque outputs by the DIN measurement. Manufacturers must now switch to the more conservative ECE measurement.

The fundamental difference to horsepower junkies is that the DIN measurement allows manufacturers to claim power and torque spikes (even if they only occur momentarily through the rev range) as maximum figures. The ECE measurement requires manufacturers to identify a power and torque peak then hold it for a full 60 seconds. If it's a very fine peak ‘blip', it won't be sustainable under this measurement forcing manufacturers to seek a more sustainable peak elsewhere in the rev range which is usually lower.

This explains why so many manufacturers appeared to lose power and torque in the Euro III changeover at the start of 2006. Holden's figures have all been brought into line with ECE measurements including V6 models."

So it seems that Ford/FPV did have to the BF a bit to be able to claim the same power/torque figures when measured under ECE.

In other words, it looks like a stock BF manual phoon will out-dyno a stock BA manual phoon, but what that means is up to you. The BA are a great car, and I'd be in one right now if the dealer I spoke to at the time wasn't such as arsehat. Was even the same colour, and had leather too

From what I have read most BAII Phoons run 220-240 RWKW stock.Mine ran 228 on the HPF Dyno.

yea mate my BA has run between 220 to 235 rwkw on different dynos..