http://www.v8supercar.com.au/news/latestne...mp;gid=32662868
We can't take a trick this year. Not like 888 to much such a stupid mistake

Its all about letting Dick nose Kelly move up on to the podium, Me thinks!

Notice how they let him drive around for 14 laps with oil dripping on the track and covering the other cars windscreens, where was the black flag?

Somebody must have a photo of Colin Bond in an awkward embarrasing position.

as far as Whincup goes, even Alcon admitted there was absolutely no perfomance gain, in fact they said it was more of a handicap if anything.

Clarke

I've gotton to the stage that I just don't watch the V8s anymore. Between HSV making up the rules and Channel 7 f*cking up the telecast It's all just too hard.

Since the uprising of the 4 car holden dealer team have lost interest in the V8s

Theres nothing super about v8's these days.

Mmmmm

So a/ if they didn't use Alcon, what did they use? and b/ why?

I can't see them "stuffing up" something like that - maybe there's some hard play on Brake rules (read restrictions)??

That's just crap!!

its definately getting beyond a joke


and Ford cars painted up Red do nothing for my sense of humour either


shaz

One thing we have to all realise is that its just a business ... AVESCO are just trying to make money.

Why take the V8's overseas? No real Aussie wants this and now you have the highest bidder controlling the rules ...

Stuff the V8Supercars! I do not think that I will even watch bathurst this year ...

They are not real cars anyway ... go back to the production cars !! at least then if the Ford V8's get beat it's because of a better car not a twist of the rules!!

Once again, the Walkinshaw 4 were the only Holdens in the top 10, once again a lead Ford is penalised (why would a two car team run different rotors on their cars?)

For all those doubters, here's more proof, HRT/HSV are allowed to continue their facade of ownership (after donating funds to AVESCO) so they can gain a huge advantage over the rest of the field by getting twice as much testing and development as every other team because they effectively have 4 cars. In addition, as part of Holden sponsorship, all other Holden teams must provide test data to Holden under the guide of 'development research'. This data is also provided to HRT/HSV.

Then, when the lead Ford starts cutting into their championship lead, a minor infringement, which provides no advantage whatsoever, is dug up and a heavy penalty is enforced.

Lownds should have punted Kelly off the track in the last race and sited last seasons as it being accepted racing practice.

and no prizes for guessing the outcome if Lowndes did do that ..

would love to see that little @#$#@% @#$#@$ get a dose of his own medicine

shaz

Not sure what you’re all on about, if you look at Team Championship points it all looks fairly close and even......

1 Toll HSV Dealer Team 527
2 Holden Racing Team 374
3 Team Vodafone 353
4 Stone Brothers Racing 244
5 Jim Beam Racing 240
6 Ford Performance Racing 231
7 Tasman Motorsport 123
8 Garry Rogers Motorsport 65
9 Fujitsu Racing 52
10 WPS Racing 42
11 Team Kiwi Racing (S) 36
12 Autobarn Racing (S) 26
13 Team Sirromet Wines 26
14 Jack Daniels Racing 16
15 Super Cheap Auto Racing 13
16 Glenfords Racing (S) 8
17 Team BOC 8

If they did ban the HRT and Toll cars on a average of the races that would put the first 7 places to ford pretty well all the time by looking at the previous races then a couple of holdens then a few more fords if that did happen then would they penalise ford with a weight disadvantage to let the back running holdens to be on a even playing field ????

http://teamvodafone.com/news.php?newsid=66...9fcfeb440d32aa6

I am totally over the whole HRT thing, look what happened a few years ago when skaife dominated for like 4 years, i am getting this de ja vu thing.

triple 8 accepts they made a mistake....

they acknoledge they broke the rules....

end of conspiracy theory

Good one Danny....you got 01txr's attention

at least i'm voicing my opinion but......

im attempting to TOUGHEN THE f*ck UP so to speak

he's still bashing his keyboard....must be a good one comin' right up!

Laner you are so lame.

You must have shares in Wankinshaw racing.

Everyone can see how there is one rule for everyone including non hrt/toss holden teams, and then there is the rule's for tom's cars and team.

I a long with many others on here would not care if it was a fair playing ground and we got beat by a better team/car.

That is what the case is we are getting beaten by a cheat.

As another person said "WHY WAS THAT SMOKEY HOLDEN NOT BLACK FLAG"

And you mean to tell me every thing on the hrt/toss cars are always legit.

Ok I watched the end of the last race and enjoyed the tussle between Lonwdes and big nose.
Such a shame the sport is blackened due to the cheating done by hrt/toss, if only they could be competitive without cheating.

So don't worry about this crap as it is only going to continue until people make a stand to hrt/toss cheating.

Best thing to do is stop supporting it and watch it continue to go down the sh*t hole it belongs in.

And we have a winner

So Stone Brothers and Triple Eight must be cheating compared to the likes of Team BOC Or are they just better teams?

Your conspiracy theory is more entertaining though

By reading the statement on 888 website it just looks like a stupid mistake and im sure someone will be getting their butts kicked..

thanks for that.....

by the way, what do you think about global warming, the moon landing, roswell, JFK's assasination???

Well they are probably more realistic than some of the arguements here

AMEN to that

still sus since 888 are painted up in RED FFS

What more could I have expected in a reply from Mr lamer.


Tab

As for 888 and stone brothers cheating I have never heard that they have not been able to prove team ownership.

Who have been the most successful race teams on either side?

It has always been hrt owned teams that have been successful with rare wins to other gmh teams.
As for Ford teams DJR, Stone Brothers, 888, GSR, BJR and some wins from FPV.

DJR (main threat hrt) approx 1990-2001

GSR (main threat hrt) approx 1990-2002

BJR (main threat hrt) approx 1999 - 2002

SBR (main threat hrt/toss) approx 1997-2007

888 (main threat hrt/toss) approx 2002-2007

FPV (main threat hrt/toss) approx 2002 - 2007

Bit of a common factor isn't there.
Gee those gmh cars and legend drivers they have must be so much better than anyone else.

Has anyone got the win tallies for each team for the championships?

Lowndes cracked up a few for them, and I do recall that big nose played bride's maid many a time.
And they where both in the same team in same equipment.

I suppose I must be backing the wrong manufacturer.
Stange that gmh has had 21 recalls in a 9 year model series with the vt-vy
How many recalls has Ford had? maybe no more than 1/2 a dozen in the last 9 years?

Might as well be beaten by a Leyland p76 (about same build quality as what gmh dish out)


back on 888 penality now.

Maybe they could have made a FINACIAL AGREEMENT on the ruling on the outdated inferior and heavier brake disk that Alcon said would not have made any ADVANTAGE.

It's as bad as not wearing your underwear (Ambrose).
How about the loose wire in Ambrose car.
The racing room penality.
Have you ever heard of hrt/toss coping a bogus crap penality like these.

I suppose next a Leading Ford contender will be penalised for taking his hand off the steering wheel to wipe the oil off his visor that comes from a hrt/toss cars.

Ssssh quick! all Ford teams better remove those Model T brake drums that where control brakes for all Ford teams last year.
You may get a penality like 888 copped if your found out.
Better still take them in your car and when you get close to a hrt/toss car let them fly, it's one way to get rid of the excess stock.
It will be alright just make a finacial agreement with the governing body and all will be sweet.



Bring back production car racing and appoint a promotor that isn't open to finacial agreements (bribe's)
Maybe train up some monkeys, they would more than likely do a better job than what is currently on offer.

Whats good for one should be good for the other HRT and Walky have gotten off the hook too easily, but it is a business, and the mighty $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ will decide who wins. I just can't be bothered watchng anymore, the comments on this Site are more amusing
They never landed on the moon because its not even really there
Millions of ufo's buzz roswell daily, It was one of them who shot JKF

The global warming thing is mostly media driven crap though, and a good way for multi nationals to make fortunes off carbon credit trading and for governments to get more tax.
When Mt St Helens blew up it in the 1980s and released more then 400 years of combined human pollution and atmospheric crap in one day, so we can ban this and that and do whatever we want, the one decent volcanic eruption and we are another 3 to 400 years behind the 8 ball instantly. The ice caps are actually condensing more ice then ever, thats why some bits are falling off. Weather patterns change continuously.
Sure we should look after the planet, but don't let Al Gores theory throw you off balance, he's got less scientific credibility than my 14 year old daughter. The BBC aired a show in the UK 2 months ago and as they said there are over 12,000 environmental scientists who say the whole thing is bollocks. The ABC in Aus have bought the rights to the doco and it will be interesting to see what happens to popular when it's aired here. It helped me understand why Howard and Bush won't sign the Kyoto agreement, and here I was thinking they were environmental terrorists
Anyway back to the supercars. If they keep it up in the biased way they are they will keep losing viewers and the whole thing will become a non event. Which might not be a bad thing if we go back to slightly modded production cars like we all drive. Thats if Ford and GM don't collapse in the meantime

totally agree with Bring back production car racing..

With the slogan.. "Keeping It Real"




as for the rest of the issues..

What the hell did Pluto ever do to anyone

shaz

JFK is dead

UFOs are real (I saw a bird and couldn't identify it).

Al Gore is a political spin doctor who made money and popularity from taking the alarmist and popular point of view (more co2s are emitted from the oceans than all of human production).

On the V8s, we know from Ambrose's example, if 888 didn't accept the penalty, they'd get fined for speaking out. We also know for past HRT/HSV discrepancies (such as illegal engine management systems, traction control, dual ownership, etc) that they have never rreceived any more than a slap on the wrist, and certainly never had results excluded.

Essentially, the issue is nothing to do with weather 888 breached the rules, the issue is once again it just so happens to be the lead Ford that cops a harsh penalty for a minor infringement while the red boys continually get away with major breaches. In the case of dual ownership, HRT/HSV were given months and extension after extension to appeal and make their case, whereas the Ford guys are given instant penalties. I'm not trying to be a conspirasist, but if guys like Laner can't see the facts that V8s are unbalanced to say the least, then you certainly have your heads in the clouds.

I was watching the first race at a party on Sunday, with a mix of Ford and Holden supporters. Not one of them thought the series was fair and all of them wanted to see the return of production car racing so they could see real cars compete. Lets not forget the whole reason the V8 series started, because Holden didn't have a product that could compete in a production based series. Simple as that.

It's much nicer up here. Get a good view of the UFO's and there's minimal impact from global warming.


Did any of you guys actually watch all three races? I'm surprised for people that are turning their backs on the sports, you know quite a bit about what's going on. Or is it just that you think you know what's going on?

Yeah there's allot of unfair calls I don't dispute that, but that’s life. Deal with it. Would much rather be supporting teams that are playing it fair and not winning than vice versa - that's enough to ensure I have a good night’s sleep.

Tab, I still watch the sport, because I love motorsport (although I must admit I no longer care weather I miss the V8s or not). It certainly makes a Ford victory sweeter knowing that the underdog has won.

I also agree with your point of view to a degree, the more vocal we are about the issues, the more likely something may happen (not likely, but saying nothing is a guarantee nothing will be done). But judging by Laner's comments, he beleives all is above board, all teams and drivers are treated fairly and equally, and Ford hasn't borne the brunt of bias rule changes since before the V8 category began. That's when the heads are in the clouds.

Fair enough - point noted.

I also agree with you about Laner being an absolute wa*ker

I heard that Rick Kelly was caught giving Tony Cochrane one from behind

does anyone really read anything here???


i made a statement in the last one of these threads which is the similar to the one i'll make here.....


i am a life Ford supporter, i have blue blood, it sh*ts me to tears, no end, i f*cking hate being beaten by anything with a Holden badge, but, i also am big enough to say that Ford hasnt got the best race cars on the circuit, we arent winning races, we will not win the championship this year....

WHATS THE f*ckING POINT OF WHINING LIKE A NANCY ON THE INTERNET ABOUT IT???

is it going to make a single difference???

everyone should back up what they are saying by not watching V8's anymore, so the people who support their team can watch and enjoy without having to listen/read all this sh*t about "ohhh poor me, holden won again, its everybody elses fault except fords"

888 admitted they made a mistake, either way, if THEY fitted the right brakes, everyones happy, unless your gunna tell me HRT snuck into 888's garage and fitted the brakes while we all slept.

does anyone ever look at the fact that HRT has had a stable team, sponsors, and fans for soo many years that they should be able to build a winning race car with their eyes closed, they have the most professional set-up in the sport, where is there a Ford team with the history to match it?? Stone Brothers got their act together, then their number 1 driver took off overseas, rebuilding time for them again, 888 has a good year, admittedly were ripped off for the championship, does that entitle them to being in front again this year??

the Bronco's won last years Rugby League grand final, makes bugger all difference now aye!!!

suck it up guys, either support your team, or maybe try lawn bowls

lol and you say im crying...



What about a Nissan badge?

oh and Trent..... go get f*cked

Now it all makes sense.

The f*ckers fiddled with the speed limiter button on Courtney's car as well didn't they?

Well arnt they the sneaky ones..

the sport is going down the gurgler, who cares if they were not useing the right brakes

So what was the illegal parts being used?

Brake rotors (From report by 888)
Or
Pads (Courier Mail)

Or was it both?

How long do you thing Vodaphone will stay as sponsor to 888 if this crap keeps happening?




Ford Australia should just pull out of v8 supercars and start a new comp that will include Mitsibishi and Toyota and any other manufacturer that wants to join in being base on full size sedan racing.
Bring back the minimal production rule as this time around it should work better as standards are in place for manufacturer's so building low volume race cars won't happen again.
As have control componants set out like brake's, tyre's, fuel etc etc.
have higher numbers required for hologation so if a manufacture tries to use expensive componants it will cost them to do so.
Eg one manufacturer decides to include say full adjustable suspension it will have to have sold a set high figure of these componants fitted to the model being sold.
They can't use this from one model and that from another and can't say they have a projected quanity of these cars to be sold with all componants fitted and use them before having sold the required quanity.
If they want to use different spring rates and size's they will need to be supplied and sold with the model being used.

Wouldn't that be great to be able to buy a new Ford that came with a variety of spring's and full adjustable susspension.



I know there would be good backing from other manufacturer's to start a series.

Leave gmh to play there own game with themselfs GAME OVER crummy beats all crummyies in race.

gmh has cried for years to not allow other manufacturer's into the sport as it knows it could not screw over a mulitude of manufacturer's and keep having rules invented to suit them.
And not to mention gmh not having a modern hi tech engine which has been gmh's cry in not letting others join.

GMH: We havn't got a competitive engine to compete against Ford, Toyota and Mitsibishi it won't be fair on us. we will have to actually start spending money on a true quality engine and won't be able to run the current scam of rigging a championship so that our cheap poorly made dinosour pushrod engine's look like the v8 supercar legend they are known as.

Ford has been held back for years because of this and should look at promoting it's current hardware on offer in a real series, even if it is a production based series it will be way more enjoyable than the current series.

gmh could change the series to the crummydore cup once Ford have pulled out. Albeit it would be just as exciting as watching the hq kingswood series.

Yep. Well said














Now please shut the f*ck up

ok, a production series it is, then when the subaru's, mitsubishi's and lotus's hand our arses to us, who do we blame then??

sorry, but we all agree that current V8 supercars are in no way indicative of whats in the local dealers showrooms, therefore the motors in these race only cars have nothing to do with what your average joe holden drives, its all a matter of distancing your road car from the race car and enjoying the spectacle, its not always about being first, maybe the way you lose is more important than winning.

from what ive seen here, if you lose, you moan about it......puts a really nice shine on being a proud Ford supporter, especially when you consider how many holden guys visit this site, and are currently pissing themselves laughing at us

At least to loose to the subaru's, mitsubishi's and lotus's would mean getting beaten by a better car if they can do it.

I remember Bowe driving a Stang once that was kicking the sub & evo's butt even after handicapping it to the extreme it was still dominating in GTP racing.

The promotors then put it up into the supercar class along the with the Lambo's & Farrari's where it managed to finish in approx 5th place regulary.
When that happened Bowe stopped racing it and someone else took over.

Another race series gmh screwed over with it's big block v8 supercar "that they" said where going to produce as a production car.
Yeh right, must of cost them a large FINACIAL AGREEMENT with that scam.
After their success they advertised everywhere that gmh could beat the best in the world.
They never mentioned how it was a purpose built race car entered against production cars did they.
This is gmh for you, and the worst thing is they screw there own customer's over with there poor quality vehicle's.
Next you will have them saying that the Barina (Daewoo, korean made quality) is a far better quality car than the Euro Focus.
They may even enter one in the next Production car race if promotor is open to a FINACIAL AGREEMENT fitted out with hrt componants against all other OEM spec'd cars.


Have you not heard of race class catorgaries?
Ford could use the to be released 4wd Focus turbo to keep sub's, evo's honest.
Falcon would be against the like's of other mid to large sized cars.
Etc etc.

As distancing from oem to v8 supercar, I feel it has nothing to do with sales.
Crummy wins and people buy crummy as they think if the race car is so good the oem car must be a better choice.
It has always been win Sunday sell Monday.
And loosing to a inferior car because of cheating is fair and we should all just sit back and cheer we have been beaten by a car.
Glad your happy about hrt/toss cheating winning tactic's.
In any other sporting comp's they would have been banned from competing unless the governing body is on the take as per the v8 supercar governing body WE HAVE COME TO A FINACIAL AGREEMENT WITH MR BIG NOSE....

If hrt supporter's are looking at our site good luck as yes they will be having a good laugh but not as you call it, more along the lines of looking at all the people on this thread that just sit back and take hrt/toss cheating antics up there . as per your views.

Iam a proud supporter and will stand up for what is true.
I will not be bending over and taking hrt/toss up the like you.

Your dad didn't beat you when you where young did he, as this is the impression Iam getting as you preferr to accept the cheating as you may get hurt if you stand up against it.

And I will say it again I don't care if we get beaten as long as it's by a better team/car/driver.
You can't win everything, and losing helps you to strive for the win.
Getting beaten by a cheat that is allowed to dictate the sport is demorralising to all competing and wrecks what could be a good thing.

Damm good entertainment..


shaz

PS FORDS should NOT be painted red

pps:- I see hypnodoc is having a good read.. great opportunity to get these fellas listening to some "chill-lax" cds

the icon (identified by the letters ABC and a tick) on the upper rhs of the reply box is a
"SPELLCHECKER" - use it

what if my dad did beat me up as a kid?? why make a joke of something like that, again, i'm thinking your ways of expressing your views are an embarassment to yourself and this forum, keep it on topic

the "win on sunday, sell on monday" quote obviously doesnt have credit anymore, otherwise you wouldve traded your ford in ages ago and i wouldnt feel the need to argue my point again and again to someone incapable of listening.....i get your point, lifes easier for holden race teams, YOU CANT CHANGE THE WORLD FROM BEHIND YOUR KEYBOARD!!!

standing up against cheating on a internet forum, mate, its all yours, you go ahead and make the world a better place

quite simply, we have no other option but to agree to disagree, we just aint going to agree, once again, thanks for having the respect to keep the entire thread about the topic and not dragging it down by making stupid personal attacks.....

Laner, your last few posts have well and trully proven my point.

Your head is in the clouds. Everyone would accept being beaten by a better car/team, but the team/s in question aren't better through their own merrits, it's because they are being given an unfair advantage. No one likes their team loosing, but I can't recall any footy teams being given rule advantages that allow them to win the comp.

As mentioned earlier, the V8 series was created because Holden didn't have the products to compete against the GTRs and Sierras. If we went to production cars and Ford got beaten, so what. At least is would be a level playing field. In production cars there are class levels and when you break it down, Ford has top class products that would be competive in every class. What's Holden got, a big family car with an American motor and some rebadged Daewoos. When was the last time you saw a Holden win F1, Le Mans or a World Rally race?

And, if you don't beleive in win on Sunday, sell on Monday, why is it so important for Holden to dominate, it isn't coincidental that Holden dominated sales about the same time they started to sominate racing. Just because we aren't suckered in by it, doesn't bean the mainstream aren't. Why is so much of Holden's marketing focused on their local racing results?

Lets put it this way, if you were in a contest and found that your oponents had an unfair advantage, would you just sit back and cop it, or would you stand up and be heard (despite there being little chance of a favorable result)?

The point is, the more people who learn the truth, the more chance that something may be done about it. Sitting back and accepting it like you is just pathetic.

What astounds me is how blatant the cheating is.
AVESCO should be put infront of ICAC as there has to be corruption between Toll/HRT and AVESCO.

I have not been watching much V8's, I would rather watch real racing like GT Production, but I have caught the odd bit of v8's.
On Sunday I was watching the race at EC and saw pRick driving around with blue smoke pouring out of the diff. Was there a black flag ? Ofcourse NOT.
I see a window fall out of a Holden whilst driving around, was it black flagged....NOPE, Last round pRick cuts 3 corners out of the track by over braking and managed to keep his position, was there a penalty ?.... NO

Yet it seems like any MINOR infraction of the rules by any Ford is causing a instant and immediate enforcement. I saw one of the Fords with their rear bar damaged, but it was well attached, getting black flagged. Even Neil Crompton said it was a joke.

I now know heaps of people, but Holden and Ford lovers who do not bother watching anymore.

BRING BACK GROUP C